Mahitto
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Posts posted by Mahitto
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9 hours ago, Mladjoo said:
Really? How so?
Working in a specific industry can easily 'lock' you in that industry. If you develop games, or gambling software, or porn sites, for example, you're going to have a hard time getting a job at Google or Spotify or Lockheed or your government, for example. It's a more-or-less justified bias that we can't do anything about, a stigma. LS-RP (and RP servers) can easily be associated with gang activity, nazis, rape, torture and the most fucked up shit you can think of and no interviewer cares that it's realistic or just RP or just a video game. The moment you put that on your CV, they look it up and find RP photos of a 2015 gang throwing around the n word, you're pretty much done. Sure, for the right amount of money you can play it off as a side gig or you just being a developer, but if you volunteer for it? Best of luck lol. So best case scenario would be get paid well as a dev for LSRP and not put it on a resume.
We've recently had a candidate write something similar on their CV (administrating a game server) which is only a flex on that game server, it just looks quite pathetic from outside. He wasn't denied because of it but it certainly played a role. If you put down that you're administrating an NGO feeding the homeless, or being a volunteer dev for a startup or some student club or whatever, it will probably take much less time and help you way more.
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On 1/19/2024 at 7:51 PM, MAK0 said:
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18 hours ago, ImperiumXVII said:...
On 1/19/2024 at 10:24 PM, CChef said:...
If that's the case then I think that's amazing but also that we have found our problem - people don't know that. All of the statements I made were based on my knowledge and I am very sure that most if not all of the people who left have an equally bad opinion (or worse), as well as not being up to date or misinformed, so our focus should be on highlighting all of this while also targeting the people who left. It should be a very direct and heartfelt message though, not a formal staff announcement. That's my opinion, anyway.
I did think of contributing more to the server but not in this current state and I really hope you guys don't blame me (or others for it). Objectively speaking, it's very hard to justify putting time and effort into a pretty much dead project (player-wise). But... if this picks back up again, I'll be one of the first to log in, start characters and businesses, join factions and such. I used to be very into mapping (was a mapper on World).
Regarding being a dev, it's more of a personal decision but I have always hated the way devs are treated on GTA RP communities so I wouldn't really do that (unless something changed and please let me know if so). From what I can see, they're looking for people proficient in specific languages/concepts/technologies (so a mid or senior preferably) but are willing to pay... nothing. Now I'm sorry but I already work 9-10 hours at my main job (as a dev) and have a couple of side projects (hoping to turn into startups), so spending the remaining 1-2 hours coding for free (when I could just freelance and be paid, a lot in time) instead of playing or relaxing is really not attractive. And I can't even put it on my resume as I would a normal project as (coming from someone also reviewing resumes) coding a game server (especially for such a niche gamemode) is not a plus in my industry and might even drag you down...
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3 hours ago, MAK0 said:
What I meant was that these suggestions weren't listened to at the right time. Timing was very important for a brand new server at opening. People complained about the same 10 things for months, yet nothing was done about them. Since then, almost all of them left and left with a sour taste and a lack of trust. We can bring them back nut it would take a tremendous effort from management and senior staff, from devs, faction leaders and other staff and players as well.
I can give suggestions but I can guarantee you nothing will be done about it. If by any chance someone will pick them up, it will take forever and be half-done. There are two big reasons people don't join:
- Things take forever to do or are just hard for no reason - people want stuff now, not in weeks and months, especially when we don't have that upper hand. They are complaining about it on World but they do have that upper hand. We don't and we should capitalize on that. If someone wants something, anything, the staff team should be crazy flexible and it should be very easy to get. If I want a business the process should be basic and fast - I post my idea on the forum and by tomorrow I can start it up. If I want to run a scheme, I can have an answer by tonight (which should be a yes, and if there's an issue ways to fix that but still a yes) and start it by tomorrow. If I want to join a faction like PD or some mob, I should be able to do that within a week or two. If I want to start a faction, again, up by tomorrow. We're really not that busy nor in the position to make people wait and impose limits. The economy is an absolute mess, people like some grinding and making easy money so that they can focus on RP. People want guns and drugs and money.
- There's nothing to do. Encourage RP, create that hub which was suggested so long ago. Literally takes a few hours to set up a map blip and 5 random stores and promote that as an RP hub. Encourage as many people to start businesses and factions as possible and encourage people to join them rather than AFK or do something else.
Why would anyone in their right mind join an empty server so that they can go through a 3-month-long PD academy, take 2 months to start a business, a year to get money for a house and so on. And the answer is they don't, they just stay away. But I can assure you nothing will be done about it (or at least nothing drastic, best case scenario a tweak or two which will do nothing) and people will be back here in a month saying the same thing, "if you want to help just suggest something". And so one until we close.
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36 minutes ago, ImperiumXVII said:
- Why are we losing more and more players every day?
You tell me. Why don't you play every day, why don't your friends play every day? We have our data and we have an idea, but the constantly moving goalposts make it difficult to fix things. We have plans for the next few months to encourage people to do their part and go ingame.
- What will happen when we'll peak 5-6 players online? We're not far away from that point, especially since this is almost exponential. The more people we have, the more join. The less people we have online, the less will join (or leave) as there's nothing to do.
So get ingame, get your friends ingame, get your friends to get their friends ingame. We could have the best roleplay experience on GTA V and it wouldn't matter if you don't get ingame or get your friends to go ingame, so what I say on this is people in the community that care so much about LSRP's low playerbase need to play their part and get their friends ingame when they don't want to.
- What about when we'll hit 1-2 players, or 0?
It won't get to that point so I won't talk about it.
- Is anyone doing anything to prevent this from happening? Except for what's currently public and obviously not working (updates, some announcements and events)?
Yes.
- Who's going to be paying for an empty server for months at a time and why?
Not the community, so you don't need to worry about that one.
I personally left the server a few months ago and the reason was 90% the lack of players and things to do (as opposed to World) and 10% the lack of updates (which is not an issue anymore thanks to you guys, so that's a great job in that regard! The lack of management however is still obvious). My friends did the exact same, as RPing at a slightly lower quality with 85 people at a party is much better than amazing quality with 10... If I see the server picking back up and going past 150-200 with lots of factions, businesses etc. then of course I'll get in game, I love LSRP. But if it's the way it is now, with 2 vehicle sales per month, 3 factions and 10 people online? I work full time and in my 2-3 hours of free time I'd like to not just roam an empty map and look for RP (which you do even on GTA World with a playerbase 100 times higher).
30 minutes ago, ImperiumXVII said:Restoring an old backup of the database structure means the GTA V server loses its data. We said we aren't going back to SA-MP so the data loss didn't matter. If you're suggesting we just wipe the GTA V stuff and go back, how does anyone know that in 6 months' time the community wants to go back to GTA V again?
Furthermore, the most populated English roleplay servers on GTA V eclipse the number of players of the most populated English roleplay servers on SA-MP. There is a higher market for players here, current and new - new players will not be navigating the complexity of open.mp and SA-MP to play a nearly 20 year old game whereas new players will be more than happy to try out GTA V, a currently popular game.
So no, we're not going back to SA-MP, even if we figure out every problem we have and get it running flawlessly, SA-MP is gone and will remain gone permanently.
Ok but what community? The community we have right now is barely a community, it's more like a small group of friends. I honestly do not understand this decision, it's like opening a coffee shop no one steps into in an area full of coffee shops rather than have the most successful coffee shop in the ghetto... But it's not my time or money at the end of the day. I will still stick around and if the server picks back up I'll obviously log in but I can't really do much more than that.
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7 hours ago, CChef said:
Look, with all due respect, I think you're just implying that the server is bound to die. If you really want it LSRP to grow? Then suggest something that will HELP the server, talk to your friends and ask them to join LSRP, get your friends friends to join LSRP too. The staff and devs are putting in the work they could for the server to succeed.
Some people don't want to migrate to a newer server because of the assets they hold in other servers, some of them just don't want to because the server doesn't have some script.
There is a roadmap that you can look into and it gets updated with newer features, new mods.. etc. The devs are putting in the work to develop features and scripts for the server and it has been weeks, they are still working on it and the #git channel in the LSRP discord shows new commits everyday, it's very motivating to know that everyone is still working on the project during their free time.
The legal and illegal faction, company teams are providing schemes and are actively trying to get people to roleplay and give factions whatever they need for them to be active.
And I am sure that there is more work that is getting done from what we know and is being planned.
Finally, let's just spread the good word and get people to engage together in-game. There is a lot of opportunities for roleplay, devs are doing good work, staff are being looked after and teams are contributing for the server's growth.
I apologise if I offended anyone, I am just being blunt and direct.
I know about these, I've been on LSRP for close to 10 years now. I've been here during the peak and the fall, then the V peak and the much worse fall we're in now. And no offense but this is the kind of hopeful but baseless speech that was every other post after opening, while people were complaining and leaving. Everyone was saying to "just log in" and "spread the word" yet they either didn't or it failed miserably.
I am not implying the server is bound to die, I'm literally observing our progress towards it. What do you think is bound to happen, honestly? We hit 5-10 players online and we bounce to 250? How?
And again, no offense but suggesting stuff that will help the server does not do anything. Literally, look over the past few months at how many suggestions there were of things people didn't like yet what happened? Nothing. People didn't like the super hard economy, didn't change. They didn't like tapered paychecks, didn't change. They also didn't like how they couldn't join PD and some other factions as they were full, or create their own, didn't change or did way too late. And so on. People have been complaining and suggesting. We don't see it much nowadays because these suggestions were either left unanswered or turned down and pretty much all of these people have left. There are like 5 of us on this thread and 10 in-game and that's it. If you/we don't even admit this is a very very important turning point, we'll just reach 0 and that's going to be it. It happened with the SAMP server eventually, yet everyone was saying the same things as the playerbase was going down, and they ended up closing the server (and it was not because we were going to V - if it had 500 people online instead of 4 people, it wouldn't have been closed).
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1 hour ago, ImperiumXVII said:
It was pretty clear what I said. The old dev team on SA-MP had to create separate scripts and send them to Kane to implement because only he could access the gamemode. If we go back to SA-MP it's going to be the same thing, and our current developer team (me included) will not be able to work on the script directly. Our database structure has also changed since moving to GTA V and the SA-MP script would need to be converted and the entire UCP remade. It's not that it isn't possible, it's that the logistics of it make it not worthwhile at all. We can't just turn it back on and away it goes.
As for the argument of RCRP having 300 players, LSRP had 300 players for a short period of time too when we launched on GTA V. It's just hype, people checking it out, I wish RCRP success but it'll fade away.
We are not returning to SA-MP no matter what great ideas you come up with.
Can't an old backup of everything LSRP related be put up then? (a backup of the script, database, forums etc. from before we closed) That way no one needs to work on migrating anything. Sure, 15 people will lose some assets but they'd be irrelevant anyway as the servers are very different.
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51 minutes ago, ImperiumXVII said:
It was pretty clear what I said. The old dev team on SA-MP had to create separate scripts and send them to Kane to implement because only he could access the gamemode. If we go back to SA-MP it's going to be the same thing, and our current developer team (me included) will not be able to work on the script directly. Our database structure has also changed since moving to GTA V and the SA-MP script would need to be converted and the entire UCP remade. It's not that it isn't possible, it's that the logistics of it make it not worthwhile at all. We can't just turn it back on and away it goes.
As for the argument of RCRP having 300 players, LSRP had 300 players for a short period of time too when we launched on GTA V. It's just hype, people checking it out, I wish RCRP success but it'll fade away.
We are not returning to SA-MP no matter what great ideas you come up with.
But do you (as staff members, not necessarily personally) at least have a plan for LS-RP? Because our playerbase has been decreasing continuously ever since we launched and it has not shown any signs of going back up over the long term. And it's not just the way it is - other servers (on both GTA 5 and SAMP or whatever it's called now, not just World and RCRP) are either stable or gaining players as we speak, it's not the community getting older and quitting gaming, it's something we're doing wrong, an edge we don't have etc. But I personally (correct me if I'm wrong please) have not seen any sort of plan against this. I have a few questions I would assume most people here are curious about...
- Why are we losing more and more players every day?
- What will happen when we'll peak 5-6 players online? We're not far away from that point, especially since this is almost exponential. The more people we have, the more join. The less people we have online, the less will join (or leave) as there's nothing to do.
- What about when we'll hit 1-2 players, or 0?
- Is anyone doing anything to prevent this from happening? Except for what's currently public and obviously not working (updates, some announcements and events)?
- Who's going to be paying for an empty server for months at a time and why?
Or are we all just contributing (in various ways) to a community that's going to be closed soon? And if so, why would anyone log in, do 5-10-25 more days of character and faction development just for all of it to be lost?
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1 hour ago, samplsrp said:
I'm an LSRP fan since 2011, and also I'm a retard, you as head of game development, explain to me please, "I prefer SA-MP but the SA-MP LSRP script is a culmination of works by many people, works that cannot be shared without the permission of those that wrote it. As such, none of our current dev team would be able to develop it anymore" (I remind you I am an idiot and I don't understand what do you mean) can you explain, why you can't come back to the server that y'all made and kept for 10+ years? How is it possible? There's bunch of clones out there already and you can't re-open OG server that was running since 2007 or w/e?
What kills me the most is that, you have 10 players online in the most known, popular server of RP ever made, there's bunch of foreign country servers copying LSRP script style, factions that it had, inspirations and all other bs. And you can't re-open it for some reason :? How can you even be that positive when you got 10 people running around a huuuuuge ass GTA V map for months & you still tend to prove your point n keep it running. There's no chance LSRPV ever competes with GTAW, GTAW is a standart for GTA V like LSRP was for SAMP, no other servers could compete with y'all, they did not last. Same with LSRP on GTA V. It will not last, so that's why we SAMP players are urging y'all to atleast try to re-open it, put some effort into new youtube videos, maybe tiktok videos, some ads, some nostalgia videos, go through discord channels, remind people abt it. Make it blow up, make it as big as possible, 300 people hopped on RCRP with 1 month notice on just forums. Imagine what you can do if you make youtube videos, trailers of reopening and all the stuff mentioned before. Your LS samp server will have 200+ ppl always atleast for few months & it's still better than holding onto dying server.
Maybe run 2 servers? Find someone who's experienced, give him the domain of forum.ls-rp.com etc, let him run it & work on your GTA V project aside.
But if we're honest with ourselves, do you really see either working out? I'm not saying this as an insult or hate but just as observation - with the current state of the server, staff and devs should be buzzing around the forums and grasping at every little bit of feedback they receive - and let's be honest, there's basically none. We have like one active forum topic with replies every other day. Yet barely any staff is here and when they do answer, and again - no hate, just observing - it's always a "can't be done" or "in the works". No one is even acknowledging the player issue. Updates are being rolled out as if we're hitting 500 online a day, staff updates are the same. Look on Discord and see when was the last time you saw anyone address the basically inexistent playerbase - it's just random events and announcing bugs and bug fixes. This should be the number 1 priority yet everyone treats it like it doesn't exist. There were a few people who used to stress about it but unsurprisingly they either left or were kicked out.
Do you think that with the current level of involvement (and 0 hype) we'll do anything on SA-MP again? Imagine the server opens tomorrow, or next week - do you think the team has the energy and motivation to actually administrate the server, to come up with brand new ideas, to put in hundreds and thousands of hours like they used to?
The only reason LS-RP was so amazing was because of a combination of active and involved staff, and passionate people. Very few actually. Management and devs rolling out updates and rulings, staff always online to help and solve issues, as well as (very important) a group of super passionate players in key positions - faction leaders and business owners. If Roux and Houston and the government guys and such weren't on LS-RP, it would've been a very different experience. I don't think we can find such involved players anymore.
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1 hour ago, ImperiumXVII said:
I'm not sure that you read the comment that was linked.
In that case why continue developing a project almost no one is showing interest in? I'm sure you (devs and staff) can see the evolution of the playerbase but unfortunately no one seems to be interested. Unless you're hiding something from us, we're not hitting a record low and bouncing up super high. More and more people are leaving, not joining. I have not been in-game for a while now but I bet you won't see many level < 3-4. If you were to take the entire daily playerbase now and remove all people with a very strong reason to be online (staff position, devs, legal and illegal faction leadership, business owners, super rich players) how many "regular" players would you be left with? That's the real playerbase, unfortunately, which is close to non-existent.
Why not start from scratch on SAMP? Get a barebones open-source gamemode (with the basic commands, factions, authentication, jobs etc.) and tweak them, then make it more LSRP and add new features instead of adding more features while the playerbase is decreasing? As @Ronnie2Polez said too though, it was the same situation until the server was closed - in 2020, for example, the server was also running a version to which other devs contributed, many of who left.
Regardless, it shouldn't matter. These devs signed up to contribute in a volunteer manner, knowing their work will be used (obviously). You can't contribute to some open source project and years later change your mind. And if you can, that means you're also entitled to a part of the money said project has generated while using your work. But you're not, because that's literally what you signed up to do (volunteer, create software to be used by others). I don't think that argument is valid, I'm sorry.
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8 minutes ago, izumi said:
Discussing the possbility of SAMP returning unfortuantely won't go anywhere. Returning to SAMP is something that isn't possible nor would we want to take steps back to return to SAMP.
I do see your point but are we really taking steps back? Especially when RCRP has 300+ players on SAMP with minimal advertising, completely unexpected + when stepping forward for LSPR on this version means putting in a lot more effort for an empty community? Because judging by the numbers we're not going 300->150-80->20->...->1000 players, likely ever (even the other server got close because they sacrificed quality).
We've been seeing this for a long time now... "Give it time, we just opened X days/weeks/months(/years soon) ago, it'll pick back up, yet no one is really addressing the low and decreasing playerbase. We're just going on as if we're playing on a normal, stable community while people are still upset - a very low number, because the majority left and is actively leaving... while we're rolling out features, promoting people and factions and hosting events... when was the last announcement tackling this head on? None of it matters if no one is here.
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This was a great idea which was not put into practice well. It can be salvaged but a major overhaul of the economy has to happen first.
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7 hours ago, Mladjoo said:
Only thing I don't agree with here is not advertising the server. I think encouraging people to post on youtube would be the right move.
That's not what I meant - I think youtube videos are the best (and only) way to advertise such a server. I absolutely loved and still do love watching RP videos regardless of the server and there has been a major lack of them. If there's one way to bring the server back, and I honestly think this would be the only way, is to get 4-5 people (at least) to post videos regularly (1-2 times a week and a live stream or so).
What I'm against is the traditional form of advertising that they were circulating on the other server - TikTok, paid ads, marketing agencies, some even suggested real-life billboards. These will only cost money and do nothing except make us cringe - look at the text based RP ads on TikTok, they're stupid - either some super unrealistic trailer that looks nothing like the server (then people complain about the randos brought over by a "be whoever you want" action-packed trailer) or 10 minutes of standing around and typing in silence. If you mean youtube videos, I'm all for it.
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On 1/8/2024 at 11:25 PM, KaiKola said:
I think the script is great and the GTA 5 platform has a lot of potential for a heavy RP community, but right now as a long time LSRP player (since 2009) I'm struggling to work up motivation to play on this server. Obviously I'm getting old, maybe too old to run around RPing gangbangers and that sort of thing, but I still have a lot of RP left in me.
I have real life commitments, if I'm lucky I have a few hours at night to play games. I'm not gonna spend it grinding for hours and hours only to earn a mere fraction of the cost of a gun or vehicle. At the end of the day it's a GTA server, and people want their cars and guns.
I could look past those things if the RP was bumping, but it's really not, at least not in my timezone. I've spent the majority of my time on here RPing as a crack head to try and stimulate the drug trade and get some funny interactions going, but its been very boring otherwise.
I don't think it does. Like I was saying in my last reply, the only way V would be great for heavy RP would be with a ton of players. A normal SAMP server with 200 players is a thousand times better than a very fancy V server with the same amount, simply because the map is smaller and you have stuff to do.
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9 hours ago, Mladjoo said:
I agree. SAMP LS-RP has unmatched fame when it comes to RP servers and it's most likely the best roleplay server to grace the internet.
I also find it funny how people just disregard everything you say just at the mention of samp by saying it's old. RP was never the hot thing or that popular in the first case and it's always been relatively niche. Put a sa-mp client mirror on the website and that's all you need basically, even with the original sa-mp site shut down. And I have no doubt in my mind LS-RP would top RCRP when it comes to playercount, but as you said the difference is RC-RP's reopening was a passion project which I think helped it because it didn't feel forced.
I think advertising should be something to think about, as well. I found out about LS-RP about 9 years ago through the trailer, been hooked since. Numerous others came to the server from seeing youtube videos about it (the hour long RP episodes.) Keeping it simple like that is the best move, don't need to try too hard. IMO that was LS-RP's selling point, it wasn't trying hard to be the best server, it just was, it was the place to be if you wanted to RP on an english server. SA-MP and its whole vibe has its own charm and as far as RPers go I don't think better graphics matter that much. If anything the storytelling and worldbuilding is better when you have less to work with game-wise. I'm talking about graphics and overly flashy scripts by the way - SA-MP itself has everything you need as far as RP goes.
As for myself and other people I've talked to about this, I can guarantee that a lot of time would be spent on it if it were to ever come back.
Very true. GTA 5 will always feel empty unless there's 2000 people around. On SA-MP everyone knows where the main hubs are and where to find other people.
I don't blame them - unless they're just parroting what they've heard from devs/others more involved. Of course they'd be very reluctant to switch back to SAMP after putting so much effort into this script + considering how much worse coding a samp server is. However, the "absolutely never" replies without room for discussion I find to be quite stupid, no offense intended. Sure, you'd basically throw away years of work and go back to a much worse scripting experience but the real question here is who cares about this amazing server and script with shiny features if no one wants to play here? An amazing developer experience and great graphics with an empty server.
I value graphics and realism in video games and I do think GTA 5 does some things better (like the furniture system, for example) but other things are completely unnecessary for an RP server, or actually hurt the RP. I don't think advertising will do anything for us - people are expecting GTA 6 and games which bring a lot, I highly doubt we'll get any people to be like "Oh, actually I'll set MW2 and Fortnite aside and start studying the theory of heavy text based role-playing to hopefully be admitted on an empty server". At this point it's like creating a brand new cryptocurrency which no one wants to use.
Just as a note, I'm not throwing hate around. If I didn't care, I wouldn't be here. I want us to do better but we have to be objective. Simply ignoring the massive issue which is an empty server and just going forward with staff updates and features is a waste of everyone's time in my opinion. The number one priority should be bringing players (back), not a new X system and promoting and demoting Y people into whatever positions. None of that matters if the community is empty.
Learn from Romania Roleplay, they were the biggest RP community in Romania back on SAMP and had a very very similar fate on V. They migrated because it was the next big thing, script wasn't ready so it kept being delayed, launched barebones, went from 250ish players at launch to a constant 100, 50, a few months later in the 20s, then down to 10 and they closed it to bring back a brand new server ready to play. That was June 2022 if I remember correctly. The project is dead. They tried to use their SAMP fame, failed, and now they're nowhere. LSRP is in a very similar situation - amazing on SAMP, migrated to V because it was the thing to do, delayed, launched with a barebones script but good momentum, questionable decisions, less and less players. It's just that our momentum was bigger and we're not at the "dead project" state yet but if nothing changes, people won't come back. They won't see update 591.4 and be like "actually". After all, the only thing that's absolutely necessary on any RP server is the community itself. Management, scripts, teams, factions, none of those matter if you have 10 players online. A low player count will drive a lower one, not a higher one. It's not too late to salvage this. And no, it will most likely not be on V. As we both said it and everyone is aware, in order to feel the 300 players RCRP has on SAMP we'd need at least 2000-3000 players online at a time. No V server has ever gotten there, not even the other one which appeals to way more people (because of the RPG stuff).
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3 hours ago, Ronnie2Polez said:
What would bring me back to LSRP?
Probably if we ever went back to SAMP.
I recently looked into SAMP and seen some servers whom host similar things to us such as heavy text RP are very much more active than the current V server.
I'm talking hundreds of players, whilst we sit with barley 50?
The reason why I think LSRP would be better on SAMP again is because people miss the OG server/script and would flock over from those other existing samp servers back to LSRP. Even if it got 300 ppl again, it'd still be better than the current V situation. Not trying to get into anything too specific as I'm not trying to server advertise but the current SAMP servers that are active are a little more niche (such as not being set in LS, etc), LSRP was not niche. I think LSRP would be the "main" server again.
I think people would be more excited and anticipate that again/go back, allowing us to have a playable server and a higher daily PB.
As a side note, I still don't understand this and I've only seen it here, why are people so afraid to mention other servers. Competition is good. Everyone should be aware of all servers and play where they like it the most, if we're so afraid people will up and leave just because they read four letters and figure out that's a server that's much better than this one... the problem is very different and much worse.
I honestly don't understand why they're not at least trying it out. How much more can it be to host the old samp server with 50 or 100 slots and see if that works out? If that's too expensive, lower the requirements of the V server, we don't need 5000 slots. Who cares the development experience and opportunities are much better on GTA 5 if no one is using either? Give it a shot.
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1 hour ago, Sargo7 said:
Don't listen to this senile nigga, guy is stuck in the 90s with that samp shit
He's right though, and people have been saying it all along. They've proved it. 300 players on samp feels like 900 on gta 5.
I don't think it would have the same effect though, as the motivations between rcrp reopening on samp (or openmp or whatever it's called now) versus lsrp are different. They're doing it as a passion project while LS-RP feels/felt more like a "have to", unfortunately.
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On 12/3/2023 at 6:51 AM, jawnt said:
Players and groups will find/create their own hubs throughout activity on the server. Designating something like this makes no sense for a roleplay server, as well as these hubs are generally where roleplay goes to die. Socializing is great and fun but can also be achieved through basic roleplay.
If that was the case, we'd already have them on the server but we don't. That's why this thread exists. These hubs are absolutely necessary to spark some passive, non-faction-oriented role-play and they usually are artificial. On the old server we had the mall - most people went there because of the /ad spot - and idlewood which was the center of south ls, only after people started going there for the social aspects. Even on GTA World, which has a much higher player count and longer history, you don't find social hubs. People just go to the open businesses, with their factions or friends, or just roam around. If you want to do anything else, best of luck. That works when you're not trying to reel people in but when we have 20 players online, we can't afford for the 21st player who's just testing the water to be like 'that's too complicated nevermind'.
Just make the /ad spot the same as on samp and give donators the /ad from anywhere perk, or make it so for normal /ads and not business ones. More inconvenient but it's better in this regard.
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5 hours ago, Mladjoo said:
In my opinion it's not, the Management sacrifice a lot of what makes the game fun for "balance reasons." Characters are CKed if a certain admin doesn't like them. LSRP on samp had it's faults, but one thing I admired is that any RP was allowed as long as it wasn't completely off the rails. GTAW's playerbase is huge no doubt about it, but as far as RP goes a quality server with 300-400 players beats a Second Life knockoff with 800 players. I think some of the players and most of the staff team are delusional about some things regarding RP, as most can't draw that fine line between the character and the player and can't get fully immersed into the game. They don't understand the concept of your character not being a representation of you. Also, I viewed a discussion regarding kevlar vests. An admin pitched in and his opinion was "The true Tarkov experience. No from me." I think that sums up the staff team very well. There wasn't an actual objective opinion, not a thought about balancing the feature but just a prejudiced view and a hard no. Even though kevlar vests outside of PD are a very real thing IRL (gun enthusiasts, bodyguards, criminals etc.) LS-RP gave players a lot of freedom regarding some things, but kept it balanced. I was once attacked by some members of PD on GTAW for winning a situation against them (didn't murder any of them keep in mind) and it was conluded that my character is "unrealistic" based off the fact that he gained an advantage against PD. There's this slight feeling I have that most players on GTAW are very new to roleplay and let their OOC views dictate what should happen ICly, particularly that the good guys should always win. I was shocked by the amount of players that had the opinion to run criminal RP into the ground, basically making the game just a chatroom with 3D avatars. Of course this isn't the reality on the server but slowly you can feel the hate people have towards certain players based off what they RP. Giving either illegal RP or legal RP an advantage is a dumb move, they should be kept equal and have a natural dynamic ICly, staff should intervene OOCly only when necessary.
I completely agree with this though. It's impossible not to be biased by experiences I've had but there are things that could be learned from GTAW, although I still think LS-RP in its original form was better than GTAW by far, but this is a whole different playing field on GTA V now. I think the core of LS-RP shouldn't be changed and the main point should be to have fun, but not punishing other players when they ICly ruin somebody's fun (as that dynamic makes RP interesting.) LS-RP had it's fair share of RP quality problems but I don't think it's what made the server die in the end, it was a side effect of other things happening. Also, even though I've had many unpleasant experiences on LS-RP, something about the community kept bringing me back. GTAW's forums are a cesspit of people trying to be edgy and find any faults to attack people for. People neglect the fact that there's another human behind the screen, if everyone left their ego at the door and remained civil the RP sphere would grow in quality and playerbase.
Sorry for the long post.
Yes, it's natural as a server becomes big, you can't have high-quality heavy-rp and 400 people online at the same time. The higher it goes, the lighter the RP. There's a very short supply of people who enjoy this type of gaming - most old ones quit, new ones just don't. Probably 80% of the originals left. GTA World peaked this high because of the Epic Games free GTA V event + the FiveM migration, which is why they have such low quality but even there, it's not that bad, that's why we can learn from them. While I think it's a horrible option in the long run, if you don't get too involved you can have a very complex and very realistic character, good businesses and factions, people to interact with etc. We can't have a super-realistic game and even then, it's boring and people won't enjoy it (LS-RP barely touched on it and look at the enthusiasm). The light, RPG aspects are unrealistic but they are fun. Most people look for fun, a very very small number look for pure realism and having a "small server of excellent RPers" is a horrible idea, like what are you going to do, the server's one gang member will rob the only business and have the one cop responding? Get shot and have the cop change char into their FD character? You need numbers for realism, you won't have realism with 20 people online, half of who are AFK or on-duty staff, and lighter RP with 900 people is way more fun than heavy RP with 10 (mind you, the same 10, in any scenario). LS-RP used to have good RP but it wasn't the most realistic - plenty of weird unrealistic characters, many being high profile, the mall and idlestacks, houses worth tens of millions of dollar, same with guns, making millions in a "savings" account.
But that's irrelevant right now, the nitpicking won't fix the server or bring back players. It's not about the scripts or the 2 inactive staff members or whatever other small arguments people might make, we need a real change.
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I played here for a good few years back in 2016-2020, had a blast.
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1 hour ago, Mladjoo said:
GTA World is not a server that should be an example to any server that wants a HRP quality community.
I think it's a great example, actually. Why do you think otherwise?
Sure, they do a lot of stuff in questionable ways and their RP quality is all over the place, but I've seen way more heavy RP being done there than in most places - and of course, a lot of stupid stuff too - mostly because of how large their community is. The smart thing to do is to copy their success and avoid their mistakes instead of letting personal bias cloud your judgement.
After all, what's the point of a perfect but empty heavy RP community? We can 1-1 reality and have the most amazing experience, but what for if there are only 10 people on the whole map? We can't be picky and put up a lot of walls and rules when our peak is so low.
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1 hour ago, Cursed_King said:
I keep coming back to this thread to read what everyone is saying. @Mahitto and the others said many valid and good points, even if their words seemed harsh but they're coming from a good place, hell even @SCANDALOUZ who was labelled as a whiny boy was actually saying what he said because he wanted the server to succeed, we all do, we really do.
The server had a shitty launch, bad luck and some questionable management moves, but that shit is over and we're past that, we should focus only on the future of the server.
Right now, the the server has decent features, scriptwise and in general, alot of the IG issues players complained about was in fact adressed and either are implemented or being worked on right now... Yes alot of players if not most of them lost interest in the server, even staff, and you can't blame both, players have nothing to do with no one in the server, and staff cant do their duties with no one on the server - but don't get me wrong, if you message most of the staff to hop IG to help with something they'd, best example of this is @izumi, which shows that most of staff still want to help and improve the server and player experience.
I know @Mitcholodolo is coming up with brand new ideas for the illegal side of RP, and he's taking feedbacks and actually gives a shit, which i appreciate him for doing so, the lead and management are now easily reachable, via forum or discord, best examples are @Nature @Dos Santos @ImperiumXVII @Superb, testers too have and still put work in the server by helping new and old players, by doing forum work, and actually reaching to players to take their feedback or explain stuff to them via DMs, shoutout to @CYBER and @Deceive
Even old players who started playing at launch and still hops on time to time to provide RP to the server like @HIVE.MIND @livid @AlmostDegen @MAK0 @kaibr and many others, they still find motivation to hop in, because we all know the potential of the server if it succeeds especially with the developement of the features shoutout to @java habibi and @ImperiumXVII for putting insane work to make the server more polished and enjoyable by everyone.
In my honest and brutal opinion, the server is in need of alot of things, and no not script or more features, the server needs a REBRAND, server needs actual engagement of the management via more community meetings, reinsurance and update posts! even tho they still work in the shadows, players need to feel the presence of the management. Server needs to build up hype again, server needs good and aggressive marketing on all platforms.
Since i have experince in this field, i propose this:
1- Rebrand the server to "Work in progress"
2- Visual marketing like videos to be pushed on social media with tags.
3- Spread the word out by showcasing the new features in forum posts and in videos that will be posted in YT channel.
4- Do like other games do, see what the competition is doing right and take notes, it's okay to copy something from them and alter it to the server/players needs.
5- Admins and staff need to be present IG, they should be playing the server and providing RP.
6- Transparency and communication, although we all appreciate the team sending out surveys and taking feedback, there are still some points to be worked on when it comes to transparency and communication.
Like most of the other players, i tried other text RP servers, i still dont feel like i belong there... maybe i'm high on hopium and copium, but i still belive in the project.
Let's move on and focus on the future.
I totally agree with this but we also need a new approach, not the same-old one of a "classic heavy rp text based server". What I mean by this is that we're competing with GTA World and they already have most if not all of the things we want to add, and more. It's like a Xiaomi vs Apple thing at the moment - saying "we have an internet browser" and "we added a calculator app" won't make people leave Apple and buy a Xiaomi. We need a rebrand, but also a different direction. Even with all of the updates (which so many people work hard on) we're still going to be 5% of World, and that's normal considering how many devs and time they've spent on their server in the past few years, but we have to be realistic - if we're the same thing but worse, no one is going to come over or join us instead of them.
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I used to play up until a few months ago (on and off for about 1-2 months after open). The main reason I stopped playing was because of the low playerbase and lack of stuff to do. I would log in to around 60-70 players and go trucking. The illegal factions weren't too active, the legal ones (I was interested in) had closed recruitment. There was 1 business open every now and then with very subpar RP - the pit stop in vinewood, I remember going once and seeing $300,000 cars parked in front of a trailer/dive bar with rich guys, gangsters, mobsters and police officers inside, and I understand why but it still just rubbed me the wrong way. Otherwise there was nothing to do. Got DMed a few times, interacted with 2 people, drove around for hours and logged off for good. Since then, I can see it's gotten worse in this regard and I don't understand why.
People want tapered paychecks removed, easy fix. Alright, let's introduce a drug system? Fix the car loans. Ok, now you can point with your finger. Why not listen to players? Most of the fixes and features they want aren't even that hard to code and implement.
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4 hours ago, Mitcholodolo said:
Uh I didn’t delete it and sadly I didn’t see the response. But to say management doesn’t care isn’t fair to people in management and leadership and these development roles.
in response to @.445, can you please tell me here or in DMs how staff members ruined your faction? If me or anybody had anything to do with it I would like to know.Dos Santos and Kane (may he not seem like he cares) puts in a lot of hard work to make sure things are in place, things get set in motion, and people continue to do their jobs and do it the right way within the staff team all the way to leadership. If you are including leadership into management then shit I’m trying my best as well. My efforts may be a little slow or delayed due to IRL obligations but I still try to come with fresh and new ideas.
In general response to the thread:
Sadly, LSRP didn’t capitalize on the hype and had a bad launch. And even after the recovery after launch didn’t take advantage of the decent playerbase we had and get some updates out (whether it be features, QoL updates, mods etc) in a decent timeframe. We’ve had staff members with important roles get busy or disappear or leave. We’ve had bad luck with hosts and connection issues or rage being poo like it is. We’ve had bad factions, low quality factions, DMing factions come in and ruin the fun for everybody. We all know what has happened and we all know how or why it happened and everybody around today is trying their best to overcome what has happened in the past. I’ve myself wrestled with the idea of giving up but it’s apart of it. To be successful you gotta learn how to fail and overcome. It’s only been 6 months since we opened and look at all the issues and problems we’ve dealt with.
6 months and look at all the progress we made:
- Brought in new developers (shoutout Java he been doing his thing since he came aboard)
- Did a restructure of not only how management operates but leadership as well.
- Team rebuilds or construction (more to see of this soon)
- Features dropping at a better timeframe (it’s the holidays let everyone enjoy it)
6 months. Not a long time to me and we’ve had our ups and downs. We never put makeup over anything we get beat up and come out with two black eyes smiling everytime. Just gotta learn how to bob and weave better.
I do think you guys are doing your best but the problem is obviously not being addressed, as the only few relevant metrics are degrading with every update (factions, player count, interest etc.). There are more developers, more features, teams, activities and responsibilities, opportunities yet the playerbase is not just stagnant but it keeps shrinking - having 10 players online is basically having 0, especially on such a large map.
I think the biggest problem is that LSRP doesn't have that hype anymore, so people have no interest to play here anymore. We can put ourselves in the shoes of someone looking for a server, either an experienced player or a brand new one - they might try out LS-RP but at the moment they have 0 reason to be here, considering how much better World is (more and better scripts, more active factions, more players, businesses etc.).
I think this is all because we're not doing anything new or 'courageous'. It's the same old scripts and concepts - /me, /do, the same 5 legal factions and 5 illegal factions, same staff teams (you join as a 'tester', become an admin, management etc), same features basically - even if they're slightly different. Why not try something completely different? Lay out a new direction for the community, something that has not been done before, what do you have to lose, the 10 people who mostly AFK online and the 10 more who only join for events? Imagine a server with unlimited money, everything is free (houses, cars, businesses), everyone can get anything right away. I don't think this is a good idea but it's something that has not been done before, so something like that. Use more RPG elements, people like them, but focus on heavy RP - introduce more grindy stuff, let people grind their way to $1m if they want to, but make RP more profitable. Make it super easy to join, create new characters, extremely easy to start a business or factions even if we have 50 factions with 2-3 players. Unless you guys do something and do it quickly, these 10-20 online players will not suddenly go up to 50, 100, 500, 1000. They'll just leave and we'll have a feature-rich super-developer empty server and community.
There's no point in heavily regulating everything and everyone if there's no one here.
And also, encourage discussions, especially on the forums. Serious discussions about the issues on the server, suggestions, just random stuff about the state of the server. You don't even know how much hype the 'what ifs' can bring.
37 minutes ago, Scheming said:W Mmartin cause why tf would a grown ass man lie to someone he'll never meet.
I understand both sides - if your house was just broken into, you're probably still traumatized (on top of the missing stuff) and someone invalidating your experience can absolutely be enraging. On the other hand, though, a person looking forward to the server's launch after it was delayed for the 14th time for various reasons and seeing an update stating the main dev/manager was robbed of everything very close to the next launch can absolutely seem like it was made up, and the reason would be simple to understand - make up a reason for the next delay - it's easy to put ourselves in both of their shoes. However, not just banning but permanently banning someone for questioning you is probably the worst thing you can do as a community leader in such situation. The only thing worse than this is throwing professionalism out of the window altogether and telling them to go fuck themselves. Oh, wait...
Regardless, it was definitely not a good move and he doubled down on it, which can (and did) have some pretty obvious effects on how your community will perceive you, management and feedback in general. Who would dare say something negative when the other guy got perma banned for something so petty? That's also why you can see everyone mentioning "the other server" or "left for other servers" and such, even though there's literally one single server every single person knows and probably has an account on - yet everyone is afraid of not "advertising" it and the repercussions. And instead of learning from them (the good stuff, there's a ton of fucked up stuff on world too) we just... don't. Why? I don't know.
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I think most of you are completely besides the point, saying "the server is like this because of [insert extremely specific thing or missing feature that only bothers them and 2 others]". No, the server is not empty because there are no shared illegal schemes nor is it because the phone is 2 pixels to the right, or because of some random legal/illegal feud. Adding all of these features might give it a boost in playerbase before it would return to where it is now and ultimately close. Features are not the issue and adding them won't fix anything - you can see that too, they've added plenty of stuff since this summer (which, again, were features asked for just like you're asking for other stuff now). Did the playerbase increase? Temporarily. Now it's closer to 0 than to the old peak numbers.
The server is almost peaking 0 and that's solely because of poor mangement. We have a huge staff team - some truly put in effort and care, but most don't - either way they don't make a lot of impact. The ones at the very top make all the difference and they're... not here. There is basically 0 interest from management to keep this going. That's not new though, it's been clear for a long while now - that's why the project has been postponed for years. As a fellow humble dev, it doesn't take that long to create such a barebones script (as it was at launch), especially when you already know most of the features and have already implemented the logic in the samp server. Very little was actually brand new and you can easily code that on your own in less than a year (including getting comfortable with a new programming language and the framework). There's no interest. From the players either - with how bad the playerbase is, that's the only thing people should be talking about, how to get it back up, yet there's one thread and one discussion per week and that's it - and they don't really have any conclusion.
The only way this project can succeed is if there's an extremely firm change in attitude, a complete 180, which won't happen. This means mmartin starts giving updates twice a day and puts in multiple hours a day every single day into developing, managing and playing. All other managers and staff hop in game, multiple hours a day, managing the server and role-playing as well. All of the players come back with a fresh perspective and start opening factions and businesses, there's complete transparency and support for any RP whatsoever, no bureaucracy, amazing quality control. Developers start dishing out new features on a daily basis. Factions become active and everyone puts in a ton of effort. Do you think this will happen considering the current state of the server and the general trend over the last few weeks/months/years? I don't. The alternatives are pivoting to another game or gamemode.
We have to be objective, living in fantasy-land and saying "oh, I'm still hopeful, let's trust X and Y and wait for update 9.999, that's when they will come back" will do absolutely nothing. If we're objective, there might be a way, but it's unlikely. As it currently stands, there's no reason for anyone to return or start playing here, especially considering they now have multiple alternatives.
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What would bring you back into LSRP?
in General Discussions
Posted
Unrelated from this topic but yeah lol, if you reaaally wanna put something like that you gotta mask it as being a community leader or something, bringing up video games in a serios manner in real world scenarios is almost always a turn off - job, relationships, family and all. Reddit is the same.