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I believe this must be discussed with the illegal roleplayers, those people whose gameplay will be affected if this goes through. And unfortunately the majority of the comments come from legal RPers. Legal RPers are often victimized by gang/mafia roleplayers. Being robbed or being the victim of a blind bullet in a bar shootout has become more or less commonplace. I also agree that all of our stories are intertwined, but we are the final storytellers for our characters. And at this point in time, I would argue that if I am the victim of a blind bullet in a bar shooting and the shooter is arrested [with the current system], it has the same consequence for both of us (it may be more drastic for him). I will RP a gun wound or type /respawnme and minutes later act like nothing has happened. He, on the other hand, has to stand there "AFK" and check in every 15 minutes or so to avoid being kicked. I totally agree with you that a prison sentence should not be an OOC punishment/timeout. However, I also agree with the statement that "it's just a game", "I only have 2 hours per night to play, I don't want to waste time in prison". That being said, with this proposal, even thought it may seem like you are offering a solution to this problem, [Bring more RP to DOJ perhaps], in fact you potentially increase the time of the very "OOC Penalty" you try to prevent. I just think we shouldn't discourage people from doing illegal RP(Or any type of RP tbh, Be who you want to be, that's the idea of roleplay). Consequences should be much harsher, I agree - but it also shouldn't encourage people to die to police just to avoid arrest. I think these two topics are directly proportional and it'll only lead to more shootings instead of reducing them. Overall, I think there are legitimate concerns and good points. The idea itself is brilliant, especially the parole system as it opens up doors for probation as well. It's just that, I'm not so sure that the proposed solutions address the problem at hand.

So, here we are again... The topic of Consequences has been approached from nearly every angle. It's time we discuss it from the perspective of realistic solutions. I ask that participants in this thread remain civil, because the staff has locked many such threads after only one vitriolic reply. I'd like to begin with a series of assumptions I am making about the state of how Criminal Justice works with Los Santos Roleplay. LSRP used to have a system of "days in prison" for offenses, circa 2011 and earlier. We changed to a system of "minutes in prison" around 2011 or 2012 because many players were spending their time primarily offline. This coincided with the creation of the DOC faction around 2011 or 2012, since Corrections was now a viable means of roleplay. Currently, we have a system whereby a person can go to prison on charges and sit there AFK or semi-AFK or use a laying animation in their jail cell bed until they're out. Seldom do people roleplay in Prison, and when they do they do so with no fear of consequences. Going to solitary is no true punishment, because it's just a place where they can AFK with no chance of anyone trying to roleplay with them. There is an incredibly unrealistic amount of felony crime happening in Los Santos. It has been quipped by many that such levels of crime would immediately lead to Martial Law, and it's hard to argue with that logic. People murder, rob, and deal drugs and all they really suffer is a type of OOC time-out in the State Prison while they edit the screenshots or video footage from their last gun fight or brawl. Rather than face the consequences of prison or jail, many players would simply prefer to turn and shoot at the police - even for minor offenses such as traffic stops. The server administration has permitted this to get out of hand, to the point where it has become status quo. The excuse people use constantly is "it's just a game", "I just want to enjoy the 2 hours of free time I have", and so on. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - What can be done? "Without Rules, we are nothing but animals." -Socrates "There are those men who say to repay evil with kindness. But I say, how then are we to repay kindness? Repay kindness with kindness, but repay evil with justice." -Kong Qiu Only with an understanding that there is a problem with the way criminal justice works on Los Santos Roleplay do we have even a shred of hope in fixing it. I have a four part proposal that I sincerely believe would fix a lot of the problems we are facing. First, change "minutes in prison" to "days in prison". This will incentivize roleplaying in prison because you cannot AFK for multiple days in a row... plus, that's boring. In my view, if you want to roleplay as a criminal that should also mean roleplaying in prison when you are inevitably caught. Of course, the alternative to roleplaying in prison is always be better at crimes and don't get caught. Second, add pleading to the jailing process. When a person is taken to jail by a law enforcement officer, the jailed player should be given an item in their inventory that states the charges. This is known in real life as the "rap sheet". It would allow the player to carry their sheet with them through the process, and to always know what they are charged with. Additionally, they should be shown the following two forms: (1) a rap sheet; (2) a pleading form. When a person pleads not guilty to at least one charge, they will receive indefinite imprisonment (time does not decrease for the charges they plead not guilty on). Additionally, the District Attorney's Office is notified via Discord that they must file the charges as a court case. If they don't file the charges within a few days, the person can notify the court and be released immediately. Third, add bail to the imprisonment process. If a person pleads not guilty, they will receive indefinite imprisonment until they win their court case. If they have pleaded not guilty to everything, and there are no charges that prevent bail, the person can bail out by paying the fee for the specific charge. In the example (left), the charge of First Degree Murder prevents bail so this person would not be able to bail out. However, most charges other than Rape, Murder, Terrorism, etc. will have a bail amount that is potentially very high. This serves as a "way out" for people who want to go back to their gang life immediately, or who sincerely believe they didn't commit the crime. If the person is found not guilty by the court, they will get this money back. Fourth, add life imprisonment after three convictions for felonies. If a person is a career criminal, they should face life imprisonment. Unless they are convicted of certain "no parole" offenses, they should be able to earn parole at the discretion of the DCR faction. For this, I am not saying if a person is taken to prison once with three felonies -- I am saying three separate times going to prison with felony charges, and either pleading or being found guilty of those felonies. This can be a pivotal moment in the character development of any illegal roleplayer, because it can have major effects on their gang. If the leader or multiple members of a street gang become "three strikes lifers" that might severely weaken the gang and open them up to attack by a rival. Why does this need to be done? One common response to these sorts of "ultra-realism" suggestions is "it's just a game", "I only have 2 hours per night to play, I don't want to waste time in prison"... Roleplaying is not just about the stories we want to tell with our characters. Instead, it is sometimes about the stories others tell with our characters or how all of our collective character stories fit into one larger "meta-story" of the whole LS-RP universe. If people are not willing to see their actions all the way through to the end, they shouldn't take those actions. If a person wants to roleplay a criminal, they must roleplay the whole life of crime and not just the parts they want to. Roleplaying as a criminal means facing that character facing the consequences of crime. Of course, people could still roleplay their characters having no fear and shooting at the cops but that is a separate issue to this one. This suggestion, instead, seeks to solve the problem of unrealistic amounts of crime. The Boyz n the Hood style of roleplay ought to have steep in-character consequences.

Part one of your suggestion is being worked on already by devs, as is pleading. Certain charges need more time or the ability to do life in prison, not just 900 minutes. Right now someone can get caught red handed for 4 murders and be out within a few days.

Keep going boys. I really enjoy it.

Definitely support this. Current system allows for cops and robbers behavior.

You are massively understating this.

I like how a phenomenal suggestion is being low-key ghosted. I love you, Tungsten. GTA roleplayers don't want to storytell. They want to have some fun and action then log off. It's been like this from years. At this point we're beating a dead horse.

Since I contributed to some negativity on this forum about a week ago during my first impressions of playing this game I feel like I want to set the record straight by admitting that this shit is a lot more fun than I expected it to be. The initial shock of realising of how slow monetary progression is was definitely a turnoff in the beginning but honestly that feeling eventually faded by the roleplay I had with people on the server, mostly around businesses and with people in my faction but unfortunately this wasn't often since there's a disappointingly low number of businesses that offer a spot to hangout and meet other roleplayers during peak hours. With the coming window for business lease applications (which I hope is soon<3) I'm sure this matter will be adressed to some extent. Even so, I've come to the happy realization that this server is a lot better than it may look on paper and that most of the economic issues aren't that bad if you just play actively. To add, now that we get social security checks past lvl 3, we're able to focus on solely roleplaying, as just passively stacking levels will be more than enough to pay for rent + a feasible car. Not being forced to be a pro lawn-mower or sports fisherman feels really nice. . This server is honestly fortunate to have the base of loyal enthusiasts and roleplayers that it has, second to no other community in terms of quality and understanding for heavy text based roleplay. Playing here is a vibe that is hard to find somewhere else and luckily that's the biggest selling point for and old sa-mp veteran like me to stick on this server. For this reason I want to commend the admins for listening to our initial complaints and working quickly to adress issues within a reasonable timeframe. There's still a lot more to be done which the admins know about more than me but I have high hopes that they will make good on their responsibilites and perhaps even then some <3. Peace

Custom vehicle textures for companies.

no it wasnt an exaggeration. could it of been a one off? sure but it still definitely happened, and there are discord receipts of multiple people laughing at the ridiculous situation when it was going down. and why should a horrible police to criminal ratio be an IC thing lol we're pretty much under martial law at this point