Traffic court ?

[Sparkles]

Hiya,

I am running the District Attorney's office, which is not part of courts.

I inquired to courts about the possibility of traffic court and was asked to gather data on if people would be interested. 

There is a forum section for it - https://community.ls-rp.com/forums/forum/284-traffic-division/

My idea when I was still running courts was:

1. Person issued ticket
2. Person can choose to go to court
3. If person goes to court, they file the paperwork to dispute the charge
4. Case accepted
5. Person who issued the ticket (Cop or Parking Enforcement) called to testify their side incl. any evidence
6. Person issued ticket gives their side incl. any evidence
7. Judge concludes

[Sparkles]

1 minute ago, lavakeule said:

I cant wait for Michelle Jefferson v. LSSD again

@Userone leggo

[30PiecesOfSilver]

Well looks like you have the motivation for it, may I also suggest adding DUI to the traffic court as well as everything regarding commercial vehicles.

 

Overall, I feel like it would be a great addition to the server if it's done properly, the usual issues with courts is how slow the process is.

If you guys can figure out a way to have it done within a few days on the forums that would be great, maybe make it feel like a municipal

court?

[Sparkles]

3 hours ago, 30PiecesOfSilver said:

Well looks like you have the motivation for it, may I also suggest adding DUI to the traffic court as well as everything regarding commercial vehicles.

 

Overall, I feel like it would be a great addition to the server if it's done properly, the usual issues with courts is how slow the process is.

If you guys can figure out a way to have it done within a few days on the forums that would be great, maybe make it feel like a municipal

court?

Traffic court is for tickets, no prosecution needed. DUI would require a prosecutor, thus would not be in traffic court

[Tungsten]

3 hours ago, 30PiecesOfSilver said:

Well looks like you have the motivation for it, may I also suggest adding DUI to the traffic court as well as everything regarding commercial vehicles.

 

Overall, I feel like it would be a great addition to the server if it's done properly, the usual issues with courts is how slow the process is.

If you guys can figure out a way to have it done within a few days on the forums that would be great, maybe make it feel like a municipal

court?

 

We are exploring options on how to bring more court functions in-game because you are 100% correct... it takes far too long to resolve a simple case.

[Cocoon]

4 hours ago, 30PiecesOfSilver said:

Well looks like you have the motivation for it, may I also suggest adding DUI to the traffic court as well as everything regarding commercial vehicles.

 

Overall, I feel like it would be a great addition to the server if it's done properly, the usual issues with courts is how slow the process is.

If you guys can figure out a way to have it done within a few days on the forums that would be great, maybe make it feel like a municipal

court?

I agree with you.

As long as the entire process runs smoothly, cases are handled in a timely fashion and it doesn't stall RP for all the parties involved I am fine with implementing such system. Another thing I'd pay attention to is reducing the amount of paperwork involved: many players don't wanna go through bureaucracy just to have an enjoyable experience IG, so I'd try to develop a system that is both functional and easy to access for everyone.

Edited July 30, 2023 by Cocoon

[30PiecesOfSilver]

15 minutes ago, Cocoon said:

I agree with you.

As long as the entire process runs smoothly, cases are handled in a timely fashion and it doesn't stall RP for all the parties involved I am fine with implementing such system. Another thing I'd pay attention to is reducing the amount of paperwork involved: many players don't wanna go through bureaucracy just to have an enjoyable experience IG, so I'd try to develop a system that is both functional and easy to access for everyone.

Yeah, as I said if you treat it like your municipal court it would fix a lot of issues with delays. Most of the traffic tickets are self-represented (From my personal experience). It just takes a judge that is aware that the defendant isn't going to be 100% accurate on laws and precedents. Also, I could even see the traffic court being done both in game and on the forums. We're talking about 10-20 mins per case tops. That could be cool too.  Would love to be able to just go watch the traffic court and enjoy the role-play.

[Tungsten]

2 hours ago, 30PiecesOfSilver said:

Yeah, as I said if you treat it like your municipal court it would fix a lot of issues with delays. Most of the traffic tickets are self-represented (From my personal experience). It just takes a judge that is aware that the defendant isn't going to be 100% accurate on laws and precedents. Also, I could even see the traffic court being done both in game and on the forums. We're talking about 10-20 mins per case tops. That could be cool too.  Would love to be able to just go watch the traffic court and enjoy the role-play.

 

One problem we have run into when planning out Traffic Court is how to get the officer's narrative. Typically in real traffic court, if the officer doesn't show up the ticket is dismissed - but for game purposes, this isn't exactly fair since many officers/deputies won't be able to show up depending on timezones. Do you have any suggestions on how we might fix that part? If we can figure that out, I can definitely see a future for Traffic hearings on a scheduled basis.

[30PiecesOfSilver]

21 hours ago, Tungsten said:

 

One problem we have run into when planning out Traffic Court is how to get the officer's narrative. Typically in real traffic court, if the officer doesn't show up the ticket is dismissed - but for game purposes, this isn't exactly fair since many officers/deputies won't be able to show up depending on timezones. Do you have any suggestions on how we might fix that part? If we can figure that out, I can definitely see a future for Traffic hearings on a scheduled basis.

Yeah, I figured that would be the main problem with In game court. But maybe have someone represent the officer on their behalf? We're talking traffic infractions anyways, dashcam footage present in most cases? I don't have a definitive solution for you. I shall think about it during this week.

[Sparkles]

5 hours ago, 30PiecesOfSilver said:

Yeah, I figured that would be the main problem with In game court. But maybe have someone represent the officer on their behalf? We're talking traffic infractions anyways, dashcam footage present in most cases? I don't have a definitive solution for you. I shall think about it during this week.

Problem is there's nothing on the ticket format for anyone to add dashcam footage. So you'd have to wait on the ticketing person (PD/SD or in cases of parking tickets, city parking) to reply with the dashcam, and if it's not an actual video, then there's no real easy way to settle disputes on it. 

 

Doing it on the forum will be quickest and easiest way to resolve for all parties. Person posts a simple format (keyword - simple as to not overwhelm people or they won't do it) then once accepted the ticketing person is notified and has 24/48 hours to respond. 

[HP3]

With what little time I have to play for a hour a or two on a day off, I don't want to spend those hours RPing traffic court or filling out forms for nothing. I come on to patrol and log. This is more for people who make this server their life. This idea will only last a week until you get flooded with cases because Tom units are issuing tickets left and right. Focus on something better. If I get a forum notification about having to write a whole essay about why I stopped a mallrat and issued a ticket. I ain't responding. Throw it out lol.

Edited July 31, 2023 by HP3

[Sparkles]

1 hour ago, HP3 said:

With what little time I have to play for a hour a or two on a day off, I don't want to spend those hours RPing traffic court or filling out forms for nothing. I come on to patrol and log. This is more for people who make this server their life. This idea will only last a week until you get flooded with cases because Tom units are issuing tickets left and right. Focus on something better. If I get a forum notification about having to write a whole essay about why I stopped a mallrat and issued a ticket. I ain't responding. Throw it out lol.

Nobody is asking for an essay. Those you ticket, just like the ones you arrest, have a right to dispute the charges placed against them.  
If your char refuses to show up to court time and time again, that's your problem, not the courts or the players you ticket.  It's not an essay, it's a brief explanation and any evidence you have to give your case.

[Tungsten]

5 hours ago, HP3 said:

With what little time I have to play for a hour a or two on a day off, I don't want to spend those hours RPing traffic court or filling out forms for nothing. I come on to patrol and log. This is more for people who make this server their life. This idea will only last a week until you get flooded with cases because Tom units are issuing tickets left and right. Focus on something better. If I get a forum notification about having to write a whole essay about why I stopped a mallrat and issued a ticket. I ain't responding. Throw it out lol.

 

You already have to write arrest records when you jail someone. What if this same "Narrative" box in-game was required to issue a citation, and those notes followed the citation no matter what? The purpose of doing such a "record" would be so that you don't have to show up to the court hearing, but the issued party also gets a chance to appeal it. In fact, you would be more likely to be summoned to court if no such record exists. It's not just a matter of you not showing up - that would mean the ticket gets dismissed by default.

 

A citation record can be something as simple as:

Quote

Officer witnessed Black Sultan, LP 123456, fail to yield at intersection of Dingle Street and Berry Avenue. Citation issued.

EVIDENCE: Dashcam footage supports the above narrative.

 

With such a narrative, we are bound by both server rules and the Penal Code to give "full weight" to officer testimony.
 

If the system was completely in-game and streamlined, would it be less of an issue for you to participate?

Edited August 1, 2023 by Tungsten

[30PiecesOfSilver]

18 hours ago, HP3 said:

With what little time I have to play for a hour a or two on a day off, I don't want to spend those hours RPing traffic court or filling out forms for nothing. I come on to patrol and log. This is more for people who make this server their life. This idea will only last a week until you get flooded with cases because Tom units are issuing tickets left and right. Focus on something better. If I get a forum notification about having to write a whole essay about why I stopped a mallrat and issued a ticket. I ain't responding. Throw it out lol.

No offense but if typing a small paragraph for a ticket makes you not respond you might want to re-evaluate your faction choice. As stated above no one is talking about writing a freaking essay but just a paragraph to briefly describe the situation. If you're that lazy then maybe a heavy roleplay server isn't your place especially in a legal faction.

 

Point number 2 is only a minority of players will go through the process. Just like real life if you know you're in the wrong you won't contest it.

 

At the end of the day we're talking about more or less writing 1 paragraph to describe what happened...

[Sparkles]

On 8/1/2023 at 8:48 AM, 30PiecesOfSilver said:

No offense but if typing a small paragraph for a ticket makes you not respond you might want to re-evaluate your faction choice. As stated above no one is talking about writing a freaking essay but just a paragraph to briefly describe the situation. If you're that lazy then maybe a heavy roleplay server isn't your place especially in a legal faction.

 

Point number 2 is only a minority of players will go through the process. Just like real life if you know you're in the wrong you won't contest it.

 

At the end of the day we're talking about more or less writing 1 paragraph to describe what happened...

Very well said.