Law Enforcement

[Eren]

My two cents on this are this...

 

8pm server time, you'll start seeing the premiers with 2-3 people in driving around looking for reasons to justify shooting LEO's or just about anyone else. Until such time this is addressed, I'm don't see much else changing. 

 

SD I can honestly say is in a great place with regards to leadership and supervision of its members, I've not once encountered anyone provoking people with an intention to escalate a situation into DM. There's enough DM as it is, from my experience I/we value the encounters where I get to actually roleplay with people. 

 

From a faction leadership perspective, we're always happy to receive feedback on any of our members, both positive and negative and if, off the back of this anyone wishes to reach out to me to share their experience then please do so.

 

I also echo Node on his point, report those who you do witness doing this stuff, we don't want them around as much as you don't. 

[Chicken Bargain]

1 hour ago, n0de101 said:

The only thing I will say at the minute, before this devolves from an actual constructive conversation as it has in the past, is that making any claims of rule breaking on a thread like this does nothing. There are mechanisms to report rule breaking and other concerns with faction members, if people choose not to for whatever reason then issues will go unaddressed.

Respectfully, reporting changes nothing. We report in game and nothing happens, we report on the forums and nothing changes. If we all had to keep tabs on reporting cops every time we witness rule breaking and or sub-par roleplay we’d probably would have a second job at this point. 
 

What is the issue with shutting down a  department? If we see 85 players a day at peak, why not only have SD (the better of the two) run policing? 

[badhbh]

I usually don't pass comment on these types of threads, but after removing a number of stupid comments - I guess I will. 

This thread will be likely locked soon, sooner if people can't hold a mature conversation; topics like this can never go long before devolving into finger pointing and stupid remarks by a few bad actors. We appreciate genuine feedback, be that positive or negative but we're not entertaining derailing/faction bashing. What I'd keep in mind, is that as a player you're not privy to the warnings people receive - or the notice that the staff team, or relevant faction leaders take to certain players. 

If there are issues with individuals, you need to report either in-game or over the forums or else we'll never know in order for any action to be taken - as n0de said. I can personally speak to how responsive the Head of Legal Factions (n0de) is in addressing concerns that the community have, and putting rules in place based on that feedback often to the dismay of the factions it applies to. Things like, restrictions on how both PD and SD use helicopters have recently been changed simply based on the communities feedback. 

Personally, I'm in PD (not very actively) as well as an official illegal faction and I see scenarios play out from both sides. Both sides have very valid complaints about one another which are extremely hard to address given that its not just one player, it's often an atmosphere fostered within a faction which is much harder to change. Recently I've seen an increase in illegal factions sitting in public with an arsenal of weaponry strapped to each one of their backs/stored on the floor nearby. Back in the day, I recall the exact same players/factions always putting their weapons up after being shot at/coming back from a faction attack etc. because they were aware that something may have happened to prompt an interaction from PD/SD and they don't want to be caught with a gun on them. This isn't the attitude players have anymore. There is no fear which is a massive part of why factions are struggling to slip under the radar with LEO factions and feel targeted.

That being said, I have 100% witnessed PD/SD ruining illegal role-player's motivation to RP before my eyes too, and I do really empathise with anyone who feels they've been victim to this as it can be extremely demotivating. I'd like to reiterate that if you feel there's a rule or guidance that could be put in place to promote a healthier balance/relationship between illegal factions and PD/SD - we're happy to hear them but this thread isn't going to achieve that. Suggesting to close PD or SD simply isn't going to achieve anything constructive. The Illegal Faction Council/Team would also be happy to support you or your faction members in raising these concerns or ideas to the appropriate team/staff members.

[sneakk]

1 hour ago, badhbh said:

I usually don't pass comment on these types of threads, but after removing a number of stupid comments - I guess I will. 

This thread will be likely locked soon, sooner if people can't hold a mature conversation; topics like this can never go long before devolving into finger pointing and stupid remarks by a few bad actors. We appreciate genuine feedback, be that positive or negative but we're not entertaining derailing/faction bashing. What I'd keep in mind, is that as a player you're not privy to the warnings people receive - or the notice that the staff team, or relevant faction leaders take to certain players. 

If there are issues with individuals, you need to report either in-game or over the forums or else we'll never know in order for any action to be taken - as n0de said. I can personally speak to how responsive the Head of Legal Factions (n0de) is in addressing concerns that the community have, and putting rules in place based on that feedback often to the dismay of the factions it applies to. Things like, restrictions on how both PD and SD use helicopters have recently been changed simply based on the communities feedback. 

Personally, I'm in PD (not very actively) as well as an official illegal faction and I see scenarios play out from both sides. Both sides have very valid complaints about one another which are extremely hard to address given that its not just one player, it's often an atmosphere fostered within a faction which is much harder to change. Recently I've seen an increase in illegal factions sitting in public with an arsenal of weaponry strapped to each one of their backs/stored on the floor nearby. Back in the day, I recall the exact same players/factions always putting their weapons up after being shot at/coming back from a faction attack etc. because they were aware that something may have happened to prompt an interaction from PD/SD and they don't want to be caught with a gun on them. This isn't the attitude players have anymore. There is no fear which is a massive part of why factions are struggling to slip under the radar with LEO factions and feel targeted.

That being said, I have 100% witnessed PD/SD ruining illegal role-player's motivation to RP before my eyes too, and I do really empathise with anyone who feels they've been victim to this as it can be extremely demotivating. I'd like to reiterate that if you feel there's a rule or guidance that could be put in place to promote a healthier balance/relationship between illegal factions and PD/SD - we're happy to hear them but this thread isn't going to achieve that. Suggesting to close PD or SD simply isn't going to achieve anything constructive. The Illegal Faction Council/Team would also be happy to support you or your faction members in raising these concerns or ideas to the appropriate team/staff members.

 

 

The problem isn’t individual players, the problem is the general atmosphere of the entire server as a whole.

 

following up on multitude of the comments here, I’ve personally tried to report several times with no good outcomes, for example 2 males armed with m4s came outta nowhere and decided to air out 7 deputies more or less on the spot just like that, when reports were casted the attack was ruled “justifiable” since the two males were apparently “helping” a male we had stopped. Regardless of administrative POV, allowing two randoms to just rail down 7 deputies with zero fear as if there’s zero consequence is not optimal. The endorsement if said attitude and not punishing it is what made players comfortable with killing cops like its nothing which results in majority of the subpar interactions we face today as PD/SD. And the situation i mentioned was only an example of what happens on a daily basis with bare consequences.

 

Harsher repercussions are crucial for all parties. 

 

If the community believes LEOs went subpar for no apparent reason, well that was only an example of what we go through on a daily basis, this is also why not everything is reported, not all LEO rpers are going in game to spam ss and forum reports, they go in game to enjoy the game just like everyone else does, especially when reports aren’t met with expected outcomes that preserves an uphill motion towards a better par of roleplay. 

 

The issue is not PD/SD, the issue is serverwide. Raising the roof of what we believe is “heavy RP” is the solution i see for the issues addressed. Harsher punishments will eventually prompt a better flow of players, mentality, attitude, and much more.

 

 

Edited 1 hour ago by sneakk

[Twobbly]

1 hour ago, badhbh said:

That being said, I have 100% witnessed PD/SD ruining illegal role-player's motivation to RP before my eyes too, and I do really empathise with anyone who feels they've been victim to this as it can be extremely demotivating.

you mind sharing how the person responsible was handled, if they were at all? 

 

I'm not saying banning players will fix this (because we will be left without any players) and I'm not trying to make it about administrators BUT this behavior was non-existent in the past. Perhaps the administrators have been more easy-going with such players?

 

There is more to this than LEO faction / illegal faction. And I agree with you, removing PD or SD will not change a thing. Multiple factors have contributed to this and the biggest of them all is that we're playing a SAMP server.

 

I'll take the trolls and dmers any day if it means the community stays active because we've all seen how "quality over quanity" works out in the long run. The server doesn't have to be super hardcore, it's a game, just some parts that needs to be tightened up nothing else.

[Jamalio]

51 minutes ago, sneakk said:

following up on multitude of the comments here, I’ve personally tried to report several times with no good outcomes, for example 2 males armed with m4s came outta nowhere and decided to air out 7 deputies more or less on the spot just like that, when reports were casted the attack was ruled “justifiable” since the two males were apparently “helping” a male we had stopped. Regardless of administrative POV, allowing two randoms to just rail down 7 deputies with zero fear as if there’s zero consequence is not optimal. The endorsement if said attitude and not punishing it is what made players comfortable with killing cops like its nothing which results in majority of the subpar interactions we face today as PD/SD. And the situation i mentioned was only an example of what happens on a daily basis with bare consequences.

 

Come on Sneaky, it's OK because they enjoyed it and they made a good yt video out of it!

 

I stopped playing two weeks ago. Here is what I despise about this thread and it's replies, especially @badhbh's reply:
1. Pointing fingers at PD/SD.

2. Blaming PD/SD for the current server standards.

3. Relying on PD/SD to set the server standards.

 

I was playing peacefully a year ago and it was way better than it is right now. This is someone who did parole roleplay which mostly did not involve law enforcing, unlike PD/SD.

 

51 minutes ago, sneakk said:

The issue is not PD/SD, the issue is serverwide. Raising the roof of what we believe is “heavy RP” is the solution i see for the issues addressed. Harsher punishments will eventually prompt a better flow of players, mentality, attitude, and much more.

 

 

I do not understand how hard is it for Management to grasp what Sneaky said above?!

 

2 hours ago, badhbh said:

That being said, I have 100% witnessed PD/SD ruining illegal role-player's motivation to RP before my eyes too, and I do really empathise with anyone who feels they've been victim to this as it can be extremely demotivating.

 

Yeah, and I can say that I have 100% witnessed this server's management ruin legal roleplayer's motivation to even get on the server, not just RP.

 

The players aren't to be blamed, legal, illegal, or even an admin. The blame entirely goes to management.

 

I miss @ImperiumXVII

Edited 45 minutes ago by Jamalio

[Browman1945]

Henlo, I don't have any personal agenda, but I did have bad experience with two people from LSSD, not saying them in general.

Back in March, long story short, I parked my vehicle in Corona Train Track and two SD showed up behind my veh n turned their siren on without saying anything for like 5 mins straight, and dip like nothing happened. And that time, I was pretty sure they were metagaming my nametag. What did I do? I made a complaint on their website. Well, in my innocent mind thought it would work if I made complaint on their website. I was hoping that I would atleast get some response from the higher-ranks. Well, I was wrong, nothing happened since March 25 til this thread up. 

Reporting them is not gonna change anything, they might get punished but they'll still remain in the  department.

For the context :





 

[Chicken Bargain]

I have even watched PD/SD perform some sub-par RP with gangs in Idlewood and I sent a PM to let them know how sub-par it is and they respond by taking my PM IC'ly and deploy multiple units to pull me over even though I've done literally nothing IC'ly. Just so they have an excuse to stop and frisk me to try and find shit on me, all to abruptly end it to do it to another party of players. It is pitiful. 

 

 

 

 

Nowadays law enforcement will pull you over because your head lights aren't on in the day time. Which makes no sense, all to be attempt to search you. 

Edited 16 minutes ago by Chicken Bargain

[Twobbly]

3 minutes ago, Browman1945 said:

Reporting them is not gonna change anything, they might get punished but they'll still remain in the  department.
 

Clearly you've never joined the LEO faction before. You don't understand how much work and effort someone has to put in before joining the LSSD. They're regular players and they're prone to mistakes. Discharging them for not being perfect is silly especially given how much time they've dedicated.

[Browman1945]

2 minutes ago, Twobbly said:

Clearly you've never joined the LEO faction before. You don't understand how much work and effort someone has to put in before joining the LSSD. They're regular players and they're prone to mistakes. Discharging them for not being perfect is silly especially given how much time they've dedicated.

That's not my problem if you invested so much time. My stance is clear.